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[chuft]

Yeah, like I said whatever works for you. The motherboard and the memory will be cheaper as well.

Why would the motherboard and memory be cheaper? 9600X is Zen5 and AM5 same as 9900X.

[boredjedi]

1: That's not X3D. What is it you like about it? The 12 cores? The 64mb cache? I doubt I have a need for either. Are you doing video processing these days?


2: Will that work with AMD?


3: What was that you were saying before about the real speed being half that or something? And you have to overclock to actually get 6000Mhz? What if that locks up the comp?

1: There' no way I'm paying over $500 for a CPU heh. (if I was upgrading now).

2: Yeah they still use Intel to market the memory for some reason. But do still check with the specific CPU what memory it's compatible with.
It's usually what memory AMD has tested the CPU with.

3: That entire memory thing is weird.

DDR5 and Memory Speed:
DDR5 memory speeds are often advertised in MT/s (MegaTransfers per second). For example, a 6000MHz DDR5 kit is actually rated at 6000MT/s, which translates to a memory clock of 3000MHz.

Many DDR5 kits, including the Corsair VENGEANCE, come with EXPO (for AMD) or XMP (for Intel) profiles. These profiles allow you to easily enable the RAM's rated speed and timings with a few clicks in the BIOS

By default, most DDR5 memory kits will boot at a lower, conservative JEDEC speed (e.g., 4800MT/s). This is a safety mechanism to ensure stability, but it leaves a lot of performance on the table.

It's the same for the DDR4 which is what I have. CORSAIR VENGEANCE LPX DDR4 RAM 32GB (2x16GB) 3200MHz CL16-20-20-38
When I first installed the memory (or updating the bios), it was just showing as 1600mhz. I had to select the XMP memory profile to get it the 3200mhz.
On the initial boot up screen, the bios shows 3200mhz memory as it's doing the boot up check. If I didn't have the XMP profile selected,
the boot up screen would show 1600mhz.

[boredjedi]

Why would the motherboard and memory be cheaper? 9600X is Zen5 and AM5 same as 9900X.

The chipset and features. I haven't really looked into what chipsets are available for the AM5. Think
there are about 3 or 4 chipset for the AM4. Looking it up real quick

The AMD AM4 socket uses several different chipsets, each offering varying levels of performance and features. The primary chipsets are A320, B350/B450/B550, and X370/X470/X570. A320 is the most budget-friendly, B350/B450/B550 are mid-range with good features and overclocking capabilities, and X370/X470/X570 are high-end with the most features and overclocking potential.

My Motherboard has the X570 chipset.

For AMD's AM5 platform, the available chipsets include X870E, X870, B850, B840, X670E, X670, B650E, B650, and A620/A620A

Looks like there's a bunch already. I was looking at the AM5 motherboards and was just seeing the 870 chipset.
I didn't look into the chipsets price wise.

[boredjedi]

Crap forgot about the memory. The chipsets will offer different memory speeds as well. The cheaper the slower memory which means cheaper memory.

[chuft]

Thanks. But what I mean is, both CPUs we are discussing are AM5 and thus presumably use the same possible mobos, so why would the 9600X have cheaper mobos and memory. In the past I have bought memory based on the compatibility list for the mobo, not the CPU.

[boredjedi]

Thanks. But what I mean is, both CPUs we are discussing are AM5 and thus presumably use the same possible mobos, so why would the 9600X have cheaper mobos and memory. In the past I have bought memory based on the compatibility list for the mobo, not the CPU.

You're right actually, I stand corrected, since I do everything AMD I just didn't remember that it was based on the motherboard
not the CPU. The memory brand recommendation is based on the specific AMD chipset of the motherboard. Don't remember if that's the
same with Intel.

The CPU's memory controller does determine what memory speed you can get.

[chuft]

OK. When I looked for best memory speed for both CPUs I found answers saying 6000 so it didn't seem to differ. But they are both Zen 5 9000 series which I would think would make memory recommendations the same.

Oddly Wikipedia says

Ryzen 9000 series

Granite Ridge (9000 series, Zen 5 based)


Common features of Ryzen 9000 desktop CPUs:

• Socket: AM5.
• All the CPUs support DDR5-5600 in dual-channel mode.

5600 sounds low.

[boredjedi]

OK. When I looked for best memory speed for both CPUs I found answers saying 6000 so it didn't seem to differ. But they are both Zen 5 9000 series which I would think would make memory recommendations the same.

Oddly Wikipedia says



5600 sounds low.

Yeah, that whole memory gives me a headache. They've made it more complicated than it needs to be.

I chose this 6000nhz ram "CORSAIR VENGEANCE RGB DDR5 RAM 32GB (2x16GB) 6000MHz CL36-44-44-96 1.35V Intel XMP"
in my "what if build" besides the recommendation, seems there's pages of 6000mhz.

When I went to bed, I just happened to see this video


He mentions something curious at 0:54 and I was like you know is that why there's pages of 6000mhz ram.
Jump to 3:20 after that and then 5:32

It's a good video overall though in understanding the memory stuff. It's actually good I'm doing all this now because I think I'd lose my
mind if I was doing my usual waiting for the last minute to do research on an upgrade.

He's dumping Intel as well after all these years. He said he was upgrading to the Ryzen 9950x 3D-V cache.

[chuft]

I didn't get whatever you were talking about at 0:54 and 3:20. I guess the point at 5:32 is that for the mobo the manufacturers now ask for your CPU and not just mobo when listing tested and approved memory?

[boredjedi]

I didn't get whatever you were talking about at 0:54 and 3:20. I guess the point at 5:32 is that for the mobo the manufacturers now ask for your CPU and not just mobo when listing tested and approved memory?

At 0:54 "stuck with 6000mhz across the board" explains why Amazon had pages of 6000mhz ram.
When I was looking up the ram, I was like why are nearly all the kits being offered 6000mhz. Glad to
hear I wasn't going crazy. Its all about price for performance.

The ram list was never updated with updated bios from the motherboard manufacturer.
The list was still stuck on the original release bios and never updated subsequent bios updates with extended ram kit support.
And he has a $500 motherboard. He griped about that. It shouldn't have to be guess work. You have to take that into account too.

I haven't even gotten into the Latency part of ram either. Heh. Well we all know the lower
those numbers are the lower the latency is for the ram circuit to recall that data.

He uses this https://www.techpowerup.com/dram-latency/ to compare the different
kit latencies.

6000mhz - 6400mhz with a CAS latency of either 28 or 30 seems to be the sweet spot right now (price for performance)
When AM5 was first released, the memory manufacturers were only offering a CAS of 40.
Yeah that's not that great. And it was like that for a while.

Getting back to the CPUs, It boggles my mind.
When I check my CPU for max ram speed: System Memory Specification Up to 3200 MT/s
Simple and straight forward.

But when I look at the AM5 CPUs, including the one you are eyeing
Max Memory Speed:
2x1R DDR5-5600
2x2R DDR5-5600
4x1R DDR5-3600
4x2R DDR5-3600

What the hell is even that. I'm going to assume it depends on how many
ram sticks you use and what motherboard slots you have them in?
I don't know. I haven't even looked that up yet.

I understand the DDR5 and the 3600/5600 but what the hell is the stuff before it.

[boredjedi]

Yeah, that first specification is about the ram banks on the motherboard.

2 banks of 1 sided ram sticks will run at 5600
2 banks of 2 sided ram sticks will run at 5600

Filling up all 4 memory banks on the motherboard, the max speed is 3600.

[chuft]

At 0:54 "stuck with 6000mhz across the board" explains why Amazon had pages of 6000mhz ram.

Not to me, I still have no idea what "stuck with 6000Mhz across the board" means. He doesn't explain himself or what he is looking at well at all.

The ram list was never updated with updated bios from the motherboard manufacturer.

Are you talking about some manufacturer/motherboard in particular? Do you mean his?

The list was still stuck on the original release bios and never updated subsequent bios updates with extended ram kit support.
And he has a $500 motherboard. He griped about that. It shouldn't have to be guess work. You have to take that into account too.

You have to take what into account too?

6000mhz - 6400mhz with a CAS latency of either 28 or 30 seems to be the sweet spot right now (price for performance)

There are four numbers. Which one is CAS?

My current RAM is CL16-18-18-36

Seems odd these 2019 DRAM numbers are lower than the current ones I see for sale.

Getting back to the CPUs, It boggles my mind.
When I check my CPU for max ram speed: System Memory Specification Up to 3200 MT/s

Which is 1600Mhz clock speed. At the top you said "6000mhz" that is 3000Mhz clock? Which one is actually used when you are looking at the BIOS screen (or UEFI screen nowadays) ?

This page explains why they advertise in MT/s now.

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/explor...mhz-explained/

But when I look at the AM5 CPUs, including the one you are eyeing
Max Memory Speed:
2x1R DDR5-5600
2x2R DDR5-5600
4x1R DDR5-3600
4x2R DDR5-3600

So you are looking at AMD's web site and not the mobo manufacturer. I keep seeing everyone saying the sweet spot for these processors is 6000Mhz not 5600Mhz (which is really MT/s not clock speed, confusing). Seems odd it says 5600.


https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/co..._for_r5_9600x/

I wonder what he means by "cl30". What is the difference between CAS and CL? Which of the four numbers is it?

[boredjedi]

Yes, that was in reference to his motherboard.

You have to take into account how accurate is your motherboard's qualified ram list.
How current or up to date is it.

The first number in the latency is the most important
Cas Latency - CL (the number of clock cycles it takes for RAM to access data from a specific column and make it available to the output).
The other's do play a factor but not as much as the CL. The others are tRCD - tRD - tRAS.

[boredjedi]

Forgot to mention CL 28 (recent) is the fastest that's made for the AM5 platform. One company is working on a CL 26 forgot who offhand.

[chuft]

Thanks.

Why does my 2019 DDR4 DRAM have a latency of 16? That blows the pants off 28 it would seem. Is AMD that much worse than Intel?
CORSAIR VENGEANCE LPX DDR4 RAM 16GB (2x8GB) 3200MHz CL16-18-18-36

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/p/memo...6gx4m2b3200c16

[boredjedi]

That's a bit of a more complex question and answer. Engineering and manufacturing trade offs from what I can gather.
Trade offs involving memory clock speeds too along with the density and power efficiency of DDR5.
DDR4 the lowest latency available is CAS 14. I have CAS 16 as well and seems to be the sweet spot for the AM4.
Seems that 28-30 CAS will be the sweet spot for the AM5.

[boredjedi]

Oh and while I looking this stuff up, seems AMD is working on the AM6 with DDR6 memory.

Their roadmap is AM5 up to 2027 maybe 2028 then after that, while AMD hasn't made anything official yet, AM6 is expected
to be released possibly 2028. AMD had has released a roadmap not too long ago


Just a quick google search

AMD hasn't officially announced a release date for AM6, but based on industry expectations and AMD's own roadmap, it's likely to be released sometime in 2027 or 2028. The earliest it could potentially be launched is 2027, but 2028 or 2029 seems more realistic based on current information.
Here's a more detailed look:

• Zen 6 Release:
  AMD is expected to launch their Zen 6 architecture in late 2026 or early 2027, but it will likely be on the existing AM5 socket.

• New Socket:
  A new socket like AM6 might be introduced after Zen 6, potentially around 2028

• AM5 Support:
  AMD has committed to supporting the current AM5 socket through 2027, meaning future generations of Ryzen CPUs (including Zen 6) will be compatible with existing AM5 motherboards.
• DDR6 Introduction:
  DDR6 memory is expected to be introduced in 2026 or 2027, and AM6 is often associated with DDR6 support.