Who breaks the fourth wall the most?

[possessor]

lets also just bring this up

I don't watch videos. If you don't care enough to tell me, I don't care enough to know.

[chuft]

You're saying this to the guy who writes the longest posts explaining things on the forum instead of just linking to videos?

[possessor]

not the point of that quote (:

[BRBFBI]

This seems like circular reasoning. People often break the fourth wall while singing, therefore doing it while singing is not a fourth wall break? Why not? Can't we just say singing numbers sometimes break the fourth wall?

I had to sit on it for a while, but I've spent some time considering and watched a few films since then and you've convinced me.

I think there are gradations of breaking the fourth wall. Some famous examples are characters talking about the script, or the movie studio, or the like, breaking character and talking as actors. But that is not the definition widely accepted, which is the actor addressing the audience whether in character or not. And it's not always done for comedic effect.

I definitely agree that there are gradations. Beyond a certain threshold breaking the fourth wall will also break my suspension of disbelief, which I personally don't like, but I acknowledge those are two separate things. An actor making eye contact with the camera usually doesn't break my immersion, and I can think of examples (like the LT songs) that I even like. Your Uma Thurman example also didn't bother me, probably because Kill Bill is so stylized and in your face that there is hardly a pretense of a fourth wall to break in the first place. I always associated breaking the fourth wall with being ripped out of an immersive story by a cheap joke. "Break" is the keyword to me, but that's not the definition.

And on the topic of definitions, rather than "the actor addressing the audience whether in character or not" I think it's more like the story acknowledging its own fiction. For example, in a romance a character might say "I don't know what to say" at which point the other character hands them the script. On this list of fourth wall breaks at least two of them don't involve the actors addressing the audience (Monty Python and Space Balls).

[chuft]

What would you consider Harrison Ford's voiceovers in Blade Runner? To me, he is clearly in character, and addressing the audience, and is not acknowledging the story's own fiction.

[BRBFBI]

I watched that yesterday

I was on a long flight and it was on the entertainment system, and it happened to be the version with voiceover. I liked it a lot. Better the second time, and better with voiceover. I could go on, but I guess I need to amend my definition, huh?

I think one could ague that he isn't addressing the audience. Perhaps it's an internal monologue, or maybe he's recounting a story in his old age. Some movies with similar narration frame it as a PI talking into his voice recorder, or indeed a man telling a story from his younger days. The fact that this movie doesn't feel the need to make explicit an excuse for Harrison Ford to monologue doesn't change anything. It wouldn't have added to the movie if we intermittently had to cut to his grandson's bedroom to give an in-universe excuse for him to monologue.

That's what I would have said before, but it's a stretch. So I'll amend my definition to say a fourth wall break is when a story acknowledges its own fiction or when the audience is addressed (including by direct eye contact).

[possessor]

would your definition of fourth wall breaks accept this scene from Jackie Chan's "Young Master" as one?

45 seconds into the video, you hear Chan say "bye bye" (because it's the end of the film) and he signals for the camera to come closer.

but this raises the 2 questions. was Chan (the actor..) saying bye to the audience or was Dragon (Chan's character) saying bye to the audience?

2nd question is - if he's in a full body cast why can he still move his two fingers???? Of course this has nothing to do with the fourth wall.

https://youtu.be/z1_jR9Y-S40

EDIT: used correct terminology (thx chuft)

[chuft]

You mean "raises the question" not "begs the question."

"Begs the question" means someone answers a question with a non-answer, such as

"Do you like that car?"
"No, it's ugly."
"Why do you say it's ugly?"
"Because it's unattractive."
"But what about it do you find unattractive?"
"The fact that it's ugly."

A real answer might have been "Because its windows are too small" or "it has square lines and no curves" or "it's purple" or some other answer that indicates why the second person considers it ugly.

[possessor]

thanks


but my question still remains

[chuft]

It was aimed at BRBFBI so he can answer